From Newsgroup: comp.sys.apple2

Hi Hugh,
Let me provide a brief update here.
I reverse engineered the Module Interface protection for the 3 Robo (BitStik) variants, and added support for them to AppleWin (the Windows-based Apple II emulator) here: https://github.com/AppleWin/AppleWin/releases.
I then went on to present a short (~10 minute) talk at KansasFest last year, titled: "Copy protection via the Game I/O connector", which includes a few slides on the Robo hardware (based on some of the info you supplied in this thread): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXG6XKnaNZk&t=5632s
Thanks,
Tom
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From Newsgroup: comp.sys.apple2

On 1/24/2024 8:28 AM, TomCh wrote:

I then went on to present a short (~10 minute) talk at KansasFest
last year, titled: "Copy protection via the Game I/O connector",
which includes a few slides on the Robo hardware (based on some of
the info you supplied in this thread): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXG6XKnaNZk&t=5632s

Tom,

Thanks very much for linking your segment from that video. I enjoyed
your presentation very much and commend you for the effort you put into
making your slides.

We've all come a long, long way from the 'chalk and talk' method of instructing and learning!

Regards,




Hugh Hood

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From Newsgroup: comp.sys.apple2

On 1/24/24 09:28, TomCh wrote:

Hi Hugh,

Let me provide a brief update here.

I reverse engineered the Module Interface protection for the 3 Robo
(BitStik) variants, and added support for them to AppleWin (the
Windows-based Apple II emulator) here: https://github.com/AppleWin/AppleWin/releases.

I then went on to present a short (~10 minute) talk at KansasFest last
year, titled: "Copy protection via the Game I/O connector", which includes
a few slides on the Robo hardware (based on some of the info you supplied
in this thread): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXG6XKnaNZk&t=5632s

Do you have an idea what the equivalent circuit would look like to emulate a Robocad dongle in hardware?


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From Newsgroup: comp.sys.apple2

Steven,

I think you had addressed your question to Tom, as he's much more knowledgeable on this than am I, but should you have both the time (and desire) to reverse engineer a couple of Robo dongles that I still have
(one from RoboCAD 1+ and one from RoboCAD 2), I'd be happy to send them
to you as loaners. They do have serial #s on them, but surely they we're
so careful as to make changes based on that, right?

The guts are concealed by a potting compound, so I'm not sure you could determine the circuitry without destroying them, but maybe that's not so
bad.

I bypassed that dongle check years ago in the RoboCAD programs. (And,
they're up on Asimov).

Amazingly, I still keep a RoboCAD 2 setup on a TransWarped IIe with a
Saturn card and a Houston Instruments plotter for an occasional re-plot
of something I did years ago.

{BTW, I'm still grateful to you for sending me all that CP/AM 5.1 stuff
years ago. Thanks}.

Regards,




Hugh Hood




On 1/24/2024 7:07 PM, Steven Hirsch wrote:

On 1/24/24 09:28, TomCh wrote:

Hi Hugh,

Let me provide a brief update here.

I reverse engineered the Module Interface protection for the 3 Robo
(BitStik) variants, and added support for them to AppleWin (the
Windows-based Apple II emulator) here:
https://github.com/AppleWin/AppleWin/releases.

I then went on to present a short (~10 minute) talk at KansasFest last
year, titled: "Copy protection via the Game I/O connector", which includes >> a few slides on the Robo hardware (based on some of the info you supplied
in this thread): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXG6XKnaNZk&t=5632s

Do you have an idea what the equivalent circuit would look like to emulate a Robocad dongle in hardware?

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From Newsgroup: comp.sys.apple2

On Thursday 25 January 2024 at 18:05:29 UTC, Hugh Hood wrote:

Steven,

I think you had addressed your question to Tom, as he's much more knowledgeable on this than am I, but should you have both the time (and desire) to reverse engineer a couple of Robo dongles that I still have
(one from RoboCAD 1+ and one from RoboCAD 2), I'd be happy to send them
to you as loaners. They do have serial #s on them, but surely they we're
so careful as to make changes based on that, right?

Hi Hugh,

Yes, I'd like to take you up on this offer of a loaner.

The Robocom protection code will detect PDL(3) values in a range (when using the Module Interface), so I'd like to experiment with this real Robo dongle to better understand and mimic its behaviour.

If possible can you contact me via email (tomcharlesworth26 AT gmail.com) to share further details.

Regards,
Tom
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From Newsgroup: comp.sys.apple2

On Thursday 25 January 2024 at 01:07:41 UTC, Steven Hirsch wrote:

Do you have an idea what the equivalent circuit would look like to emulate a Robocad dongle in hardware?

Hi Steven,
My guess is a (simple) resistor network where each of the 3 annunciators (outputs) will enable a separate part of the network. So you can combine different parts to form 8 different networks (or total resistor values), each yielding different values when PDL(3) is read.
Tom
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From Newsgroup: comp.sys.apple2

On 1/27/2024 5:14 AM, TomCh wrote:

Yes, I'd like to take you up on this offer of a loaner.

Email sent.

FWIW, I donated to KansasFest (actually to Sean Fahey) an original UK
RoboCom Bitstik that I acquired from a gentleman in Sweden many years ago.

I don't recall whether it had a separate dongle, but it had a serial #
on it so I know it was protected. You may wish to contact Sean on
whether he still has it (among his *many* treasures).



Hugh Hood

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From Newsgroup: comp.sys.apple2

On 1/27/24 06:19, TomCh wrote:

On Thursday 25 January 2024 at 01:07:41 UTC, Steven Hirsch wrote:

Do you have an idea what the equivalent circuit would look like to
emulate a Robocad dongle in hardware?

Hi Steven,

My guess is a (simple) resistor network where each of the 3 annunciators (outputs) will enable a separate part of the network. So you can combine different parts to form 8 different networks (or total resistor values),
each yielding different values when PDL(3) is read.

That's a very large solution space. If you can reverse engineer a circuit topology from the software side I'll volunteer to solder one up and test.



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From Newsgroup: comp.sys.apple2

On Sunday 28 January 2024 at 02:33:10 UTC, Steven Hirsch wrote:

That's a very large solution space. If you can reverse engineer a circuit topology from the software side

I'll give it a go!

I'll volunteer to solder one up and test.

Great - I'll let you know if/when I make progress.

Tom
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