A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star Trek,
Again
n-ellison-and-star-trek-again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWrCUs primary Trek writers Scott and David Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work on
the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run (there
will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about how
this venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time rCRnosrC# turned into rCRhmmmms.rC#
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
In article <WU7xv.19243$LH2.40@fx17.iad>, Daniel
<dxmm@albury.nospam.net.au> wrote:
On 15/07/2014 12:30 PM, A Friend wrote:
In article <acg8s993skagu886sbdp5i74f2g34ho6sm@4ax.com>, Jim G.Hasn't the Edith Keeler story line been mentioned here as a possible ST
<jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star Trek, >>>> Again
http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/07/the-city-that-never-sleeps-or-goes-away-ha >>>> rla
n-ellison-and-star-trek-again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWrCUs primary Trek writers Scott and David >>>> Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work on >>>> the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run (there >>>> will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about how >>>> this venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time rCRnosrC# turned into >>>> rCRhmmmms.rC#
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
I read the original script about 35 years ago, and I don't remember
anything about a Bizarro World Enterprise.
The article asks the question, "And yet, now nearly 50 years later,
with numerous Treks behind us, the question still nags: would EllisonrCOs >>> original script for rCLThe City on the Edge of Forever,rCY have been better
than what ended up on screen?" I don't think so. The story is not
about Beckwith, it's about Kirk and Edith Keeler, and Kirk's duty to
history and the future. The story didn't require Beckwith or anybody
like Beckwith. Accidentally overdosing McCoy gets things rolling quite
nicely.
Ellison's ending -- with Beckwith stuck in a time loop getting
annihilated every few seconds inside a nova -- is beyond melodramatic.
In the show as seen, Kirk's final line, "Let's get the hell out of
here," is powerful, especially in a day when saying "hell" on U.S. tv
was a very rare thing indeed.
BTW the really confusing thing about City is just how history was
changed. Everybody thinks McCoy saved Edith from getting run over by
that truck, and that wasn't the case. The creepy little guy at the
rescue mission (his name in Ellison's script is Rodent) eventually
rapes and murders Edith. He doesn't do so in the changed history
because he fiddled with McCoy's phaser and disintegrated himself. The
significance of this was purposefully obscured, but that's why the
phaser scene is in there. What's also not explained is why Kirk and
Spock simply didn't take Edith with them into the future, which would
have effectively "killed" her in 1930. Neither story ever explains why
Edith's death was necessary.
Also, Clark Gable didn't make a movie until 1931.
13 re-do storyline??
Not a chance. Nobody's going to touch it. They don't need the almost certain litigation. Even the Pocket Books novels and various comics
don't use or refer to City.
Hasn't the Edith Keeler story line been mentioned here as a possible
ST 13 re-do storyline??
On 15/07/2014 12:30 PM, A Friend wrote:http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/07/the-city-that-never-sleeps-or-goes-away-ha
In article <acg8s993skagu886sbdp5i74f2g34ho6sm@4ax.com>, Jim G. <jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star Trek,
Again
rla
n-ellison-and-star-trek-again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWrCUs primary Trek writers Scott and David
Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work on
the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run (there
will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about how >> this venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time rCRnosrC# turned into >> rCRhmmmms.rC#
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
betterI read the original script about 35 years ago, and I don't remember anything about a Bizarro World Enterprise.
The article asks the question, "And yet, now nearly 50 years later,
with numerous Treks behind us, the question still nags: would EllisonrCOs original script for rCLThe City on the Edge of Forever,rCY have been
than what ended up on screen?" I don't think so. The story is not
about Beckwith, it's about Kirk and Edith Keeler, and Kirk's duty to history and the future. The story didn't require Beckwith or anybody
like Beckwith. Accidentally overdosing McCoy gets things rolling quite nicely.
Ellison's ending -- with Beckwith stuck in a time loop getting
annihilated every few seconds inside a nova -- is beyond melodramatic.
In the show as seen, Kirk's final line, "Let's get the hell out of
here," is powerful, especially in a day when saying "hell" on U.S. tv
was a very rare thing indeed.
BTW the really confusing thing about City is just how history was
changed. Everybody thinks McCoy saved Edith from getting run over by
that truck, and that wasn't the case. The creepy little guy at the
rescue mission (his name in Ellison's script is Rodent) eventually
rapes and murders Edith. He doesn't do so in the changed history
because he fiddled with McCoy's phaser and disintegrated himself. The significance of this was purposefully obscured, but that's why the
phaser scene is in there. What's also not explained is why Kirk and
Spock simply didn't take Edith with them into the future, which would
have effectively "killed" her in 1930. Neither story ever explains why Edith's death was necessary.
Also, Clark Gable didn't make a movie until 1931.
Hasn't the Edith Keeler story line been mentioned here as a possible ST
13 re-do storyline??
Daniel sent the following on Tue, 15 Jul 2014 21:04:08 +1000:http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/07/the-city-that-never-sleeps-or-goes-away-
On 15/07/2014 12:30 PM, A Friend wrote:
In article <acg8s993skagu886sbdp5i74f2g34ho6sm@4ax.com>, Jim G. <jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star Trek, >> Again
howharla
n-ellison-and-star-trek-again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWes primary Trek writers Scott and David
Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work on >> the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run (there >> will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about
this venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time anose turned into
ahmmmms.e
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
I read the original script about 35 years ago, and I don't remember anything about a Bizarro World Enterprise.
The article asks the question, "And yet, now nearly 50 years later,
with numerous Treks behind us, the question still nags: would EllisonAs original script for oThe City on the Edge of Forever,o have been better than what ended up on screen?" I don't think so. The story is not
about Beckwith, it's about Kirk and Edith Keeler, and Kirk's duty to history and the future. The story didn't require Beckwith or anybody like Beckwith. Accidentally overdosing McCoy gets things rolling quite nicely.
Ellison's ending -- with Beckwith stuck in a time loop getting annihilated every few seconds inside a nova -- is beyond melodramatic.
In the show as seen, Kirk's final line, "Let's get the hell out of
here," is powerful, especially in a day when saying "hell" on U.S. tv
was a very rare thing indeed.
BTW the really confusing thing about City is just how history was changed. Everybody thinks McCoy saved Edith from getting run over by that truck, and that wasn't the case. The creepy little guy at the rescue mission (his name in Ellison's script is Rodent) eventually
rapes and murders Edith. He doesn't do so in the changed history
because he fiddled with McCoy's phaser and disintegrated himself. The significance of this was purposefully obscured, but that's why the
phaser scene is in there. What's also not explained is why Kirk and Spock simply didn't take Edith with them into the future, which would have effectively "killed" her in 1930. Neither story ever explains why Edith's death was necessary.
Also, Clark Gable didn't make a movie until 1931.
Hasn't the Edith Keeler story line been mentioned here as a possible ST
13 re-do storyline??
It's almost always mentioned as something worth a revisit, but I think
that everyone is just waiting for Harlan to die so that the chance of a lawsuit is diminished. I was very surprised not only to see him agree to
this comic book treatment, but for IDW to risk the wrath of Ellison's
lawyers if the little twit ended up unhappy with things. But then again,
I suspect that IDW's own lawyers aren't too shabby, either.
On 15/07/2014 12:30 PM, A Friend wrote:http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/07/the-city-that-never-sleeps-or-goes-away-harla
In article <acg8s993skagu886sbdp5i74f2g34ho6sm@4ax.com>, Jim G. <jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star Trek,
Again
n-ellison-and-star-trek-again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWes primary Trek writers Scott and David
Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work on
the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run (there
will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about how >> this venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time anose turned into
ahmmmms.e
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
I read the original script about 35 years ago, and I don't remember anything about a Bizarro World Enterprise.
The article asks the question, "And yet, now nearly 50 years later,
with numerous Treks behind us, the question still nags: would EllisonAs original script for oThe City on the Edge of Forever,o have been better than what ended up on screen?" I don't think so. The story is not
about Beckwith, it's about Kirk and Edith Keeler, and Kirk's duty to history and the future. The story didn't require Beckwith or anybody
like Beckwith. Accidentally overdosing McCoy gets things rolling quite nicely.
Ellison's ending -- with Beckwith stuck in a time loop getting
annihilated every few seconds inside a nova -- is beyond melodramatic.
In the show as seen, Kirk's final line, "Let's get the hell out of
here," is powerful, especially in a day when saying "hell" on U.S. tv
was a very rare thing indeed.
BTW the really confusing thing about City is just how history was
changed. Everybody thinks McCoy saved Edith from getting run over by
that truck, and that wasn't the case. The creepy little guy at the
rescue mission (his name in Ellison's script is Rodent) eventually
rapes and murders Edith. He doesn't do so in the changed history
because he fiddled with McCoy's phaser and disintegrated himself. The significance of this was purposefully obscured, but that's why the
phaser scene is in there. What's also not explained is why Kirk and
Spock simply didn't take Edith with them into the future, which would
have effectively "killed" her in 1930. Neither story ever explains why Edith's death was necessary.
Also, Clark Gable didn't make a movie until 1931.
Hasn't the Edith Keeler story line been mentioned here as a possible ST
13 re-do storyline??
Not a chance. Nobody's going to touch it. They don't need the almost >certain litigation. Even the Pocket Books novels and various comics
don't use or refer to ["City on the Edge of Forever"]. (One exception,
I think: Peter David used City in something after asking Ellison for >permission, which he gave.)
A Friend wrote:
Not a chance. Nobody's going to touch it. They don't need the almost >certain litigation. Even the Pocket Books novels and various comics
don't use or refer to ["City on the Edge of Forever"]. (One exception,
I think: Peter David used City in something after asking Ellison for >permission, which he gave.)
I remember a somewhat uninvolving novel with Data trying to prevent
Ryker from using Harlan Ellison's time travel device from going back
in time to rescue Diana; definitely wasn't written by Peter David.
On 7/15/2014 9:23 AM, A Friend wrote:http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/07/the-city-that-never-sleeps-or-goes-away-
In article <WU7xv.19243$LH2.40@fx17.iad>, Daniel <dxmm@albury.nospam.net.au> wrote:
On 15/07/2014 12:30 PM, A Friend wrote:
In article <acg8s993skagu886sbdp5i74f2g34ho6sm@4ax.com>, Jim G.
<jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star Trek, >>>> Again
howha
rla
n-ellison-and-star-trek-again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWrCUs primary Trek writers Scott and David >>>> Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work on >>>> the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run (there >>>> will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about
intothis venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time rCRnosrC# turned
EllisonrCOsrCRhmmmms.rC#
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
I read the original script about 35 years ago, and I don't remember
anything about a Bizarro World Enterprise.
The article asks the question, "And yet, now nearly 50 years later,
with numerous Treks behind us, the question still nags: would
betteroriginal script for rCLThe City on the Edge of Forever,rCY have been
than what ended up on screen?" I don't think so. The story is notHasn't the Edith Keeler story line been mentioned here as a possible ST
about Beckwith, it's about Kirk and Edith Keeler, and Kirk's duty to
history and the future. The story didn't require Beckwith or anybody
like Beckwith. Accidentally overdosing McCoy gets things rolling quite >>> nicely.
Ellison's ending -- with Beckwith stuck in a time loop getting
annihilated every few seconds inside a nova -- is beyond melodramatic. >>> In the show as seen, Kirk's final line, "Let's get the hell out of
here," is powerful, especially in a day when saying "hell" on U.S. tv
was a very rare thing indeed.
BTW the really confusing thing about City is just how history was
changed. Everybody thinks McCoy saved Edith from getting run over by
that truck, and that wasn't the case. The creepy little guy at the
rescue mission (his name in Ellison's script is Rodent) eventually
rapes and murders Edith. He doesn't do so in the changed history
because he fiddled with McCoy's phaser and disintegrated himself. The >>> significance of this was purposefully obscured, but that's why the
phaser scene is in there. What's also not explained is why Kirk and
Spock simply didn't take Edith with them into the future, which would
have effectively "killed" her in 1930. Neither story ever explains why >>> Edith's death was necessary.
Also, Clark Gable didn't make a movie until 1931.
13 re-do storyline??
Not a chance. Nobody's going to touch it. They don't need the almost certain litigation. Even the Pocket Books novels and various comics
don't use or refer to City.
You DO know that this whole thread is about a comic book adaptation of
the original script, right?
In article <acg8s993skagu886sbdp5i74f2g34ho6sm@4ax.com>, Jim G. <jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star Trek,
Again
http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/07/the-city-that-never-sleeps-or-goes-away-harla >> n-ellison-and-star-trek-again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWrCUs primary Trek writers Scott and David
Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work on
the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run (there
will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about how
this venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time rCRnosrC# turned into
rCRhmmmms.rC#
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
I read the original script about 35 years ago, and I don't remember
anything about a Bizarro World Enterprise.
The article asks the question, "And yet, now nearly 50 years later,
with numerous Treks behind us, the question still nags: would EllisonrCOs original script for rCLThe City on the Edge of Forever,rCY have been better than what ended up on screen?" I don't think so. The story is not
about Beckwith, it's about Kirk and Edith Keeler, and Kirk's duty to
history and the future. The story didn't require Beckwith or anybody
like Beckwith. Accidentally overdosing McCoy gets things rolling quite nicely.
Ellison's ending -- with Beckwith stuck in a time loop getting
annihilated every few seconds inside a nova -- is beyond melodramatic.
In the show as seen, Kirk's final line, "Let's get the hell out of
here," is powerful, especially in a day when saying "hell" on U.S. tv
was a very rare thing indeed.
BTW the really confusing thing about City is just how history was
changed. Everybody thinks McCoy saved Edith from getting run over by
that truck, and that wasn't the case. The creepy little guy at the
rescue mission (his name in Ellison's script is Rodent) eventually
rapes and murders Edith. He doesn't do so in the changed history
because he fiddled with McCoy's phaser and disintegrated himself. The significance of this was purposefully obscured, but that's why the
phaser scene is in there. What's also not explained is why Kirk and
Spock simply didn't take Edith with them into the future, which would
have effectively "killed" her in 1930. Neither story ever explains why Edith's death was necessary.
Also, Clark Gable didn't make a movie until 1931.
Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
A Friend wrote:
Not a chance. Nobody's going to touch it. They don't need the almost >>>certain litigation. Even the Pocket Books novels and various comics >>>don't use or refer to ["City on the Edge of Forever"]. (One exception,
I think: Peter David used City in something after asking Ellison for >>>permission, which he gave.)
I remember a somewhat uninvolving novel with Data trying to prevent
Ryker from using Harlan Ellison's time travel device from going back
in time to rescue Diana; definitely wasn't written by Peter David.
Definitely was. . . .
anim8rFSK sent the following on Tue, 15 Jul 2014 12:04:55 -0700:http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/07/the-city-that-never-sleeps-or-goes-a
In article <hvqas954jq3q4hh4ls4s0je41p56tekp2r@4ax.com>,
Jim G. <jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
Daniel sent the following on Tue, 15 Jul 2014 21:04:08 +1000:
On 15/07/2014 12:30 PM, A Friend wrote:
In article <acg8s993skagu886sbdp5i74f2g34ho6sm@4ax.com>, Jim G. <jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star
Trek,
Again
Davidway-
harla
n-ellison-and-star-trek-again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWes primary Trek writers Scott and
aboutTipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work >> on
the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this >> release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run
(there
will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly
how
this venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time anose turned
into
ahmmmms.e
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
anybodyI read the original script about 35 years ago, and I don't remember anything about a Bizarro World Enterprise.
The article asks the question, "And yet, now nearly 50 years later, with numerous Treks behind us, the question still nags: would EllisonAs
original script for oThe City on the Edge of Forever,o have been better
than what ended up on screen?" I don't think so. The story is not about Beckwith, it's about Kirk and Edith Keeler, and Kirk's duty to history and the future. The story didn't require Beckwith or
tvlike Beckwith. Accidentally overdosing McCoy gets things rolling quite
nicely.
Ellison's ending -- with Beckwith stuck in a time loop getting annihilated every few seconds inside a nova -- is beyond melodramatic.
In the show as seen, Kirk's final line, "Let's get the hell out of here," is powerful, especially in a day when saying "hell" on U.S.
bywas a very rare thing indeed.
BTW the really confusing thing about City is just how history was changed. Everybody thinks McCoy saved Edith from getting run over
wouldthat truck, and that wasn't the case. The creepy little guy at the rescue mission (his name in Ellison's script is Rodent) eventually rapes and murders Edith. He doesn't do so in the changed history because he fiddled with McCoy's phaser and disintegrated himself. The
significance of this was purposefully obscured, but that's why the phaser scene is in there. What's also not explained is why Kirk and Spock simply didn't take Edith with them into the future, which
SThave effectively "killed" her in 1930. Neither story ever explains why
Edith's death was necessary.
Also, Clark Gable didn't make a movie until 1931.
Hasn't the Edith Keeler story line been mentioned here as a possible
13 re-do storyline??
It's almost always mentioned as something worth a revisit, but I think that everyone is just waiting for Harlan to die so that the chance of a lawsuit is diminished. I was very surprised not only to see him agree to this comic book treatment, but for IDW to risk the wrath of Ellison's lawyers if the little twit ended up unhappy with things. But then again, I suspect that IDW's own lawyers aren't too shabby, either.
Okay, seriously, when have you ever seen HE sue because he didn't like
the outcome, as opposed to, they just stole the idea?
I'm thinking "unhappy with things" as in "unhappy that he doesn't get everything his way," rather than "unhappy with the outcome."
As for stealing his ideas, there are lots of issues with that one. I
thought that his claim regarding the original Terminator movie was
stretching reality to the breaking point, for example. YMMV.
If he doesn't
like the changes, he just gives them the Cordwainer Bird. The people he sues are, for instance, Jim Cameron, who not only stole two of his
stories (and a couple from others as well) but went around BRAGGING
about it.* He sued and won against Paramount for FUTURE COP, Paramount turning over an inter office menu saying "let's screw over this little
Jew and steal his idea" and used the settlement to buy a billboard
across the street encouraging writers not to roll over and take it in
the backside. He's had a bunch of suits against people that illegally posted his work online. He withdrew his suit against IN TIME when they changed it enough. He sued Paramount for not paying him royalties on
CITY for 40 years. He sued the lazy and worthless Writer's Guild for making him sue other people in the first place (heh).
When he doesn't like the outcome? He gave the Cordwainer Bird to:
2 episodes of THE HUNGER (the series)
2 movie compilations of THE STARLOST (rather famously)
All 16 episodes of THE STARLOST
1 episode of THE FLYING NUN
And as near as I can tell, that's it, with no overlap of suing and
giving them the Bird.
Those are all fair points, but since when do we allow fair points to
keep us from picking on Hollywood types here?
*The sole exception I know of HE suing over something other than having his work stolen being Fantagraphics, who posted lies about him on their website, and he won, 'cause they were lies, and didn't take any money - all he wanted was their lies taken off their website.
I'm not saying that he was wrong to sue in 100% of the cases where he
sued. I'm just saying that he has a rep for it, and it's not always a
case of him being 100% in the right in those cases. I respect his talent
as a writer; I just have lots of issues with his ability to play well
with others and to not be a little jerk at times when he doesn't get everything his way. "High-maintenance" is a term that perfectly
describes the guy, IMO.
In article <hvqas954jq3q4hh4ls4s0je41p56tekp2r@4ax.com>,Trek,
Jim G. <jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
Daniel sent the following on Tue, 15 Jul 2014 21:04:08 +1000:
On 15/07/2014 12:30 PM, A Friend wrote:
In article <acg8s993skagu886sbdp5i74f2g34ho6sm@4ax.com>, Jim G. <jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star
http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/07/the-city-that-never-sleeps-or-goes-away-Again
onharla
n-ellison-and-star-trek-again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWes primary Trek writers Scott and David >> Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work
(therethe Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run
howwill be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about
this venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time anose turned into >> ahmmmms.e
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
EllisonAsI read the original script about 35 years ago, and I don't remember anything about a Bizarro World Enterprise.
The article asks the question, "And yet, now nearly 50 years later, with numerous Treks behind us, the question still nags: would
betteroriginal script for oThe City on the Edge of Forever,o have been
quitethan what ended up on screen?" I don't think so. The story is not about Beckwith, it's about Kirk and Edith Keeler, and Kirk's duty to history and the future. The story didn't require Beckwith or anybody like Beckwith. Accidentally overdosing McCoy gets things rolling
whynicely.
Ellison's ending -- with Beckwith stuck in a time loop getting annihilated every few seconds inside a nova -- is beyond melodramatic. In the show as seen, Kirk's final line, "Let's get the hell out of here," is powerful, especially in a day when saying "hell" on U.S. tv was a very rare thing indeed.
BTW the really confusing thing about City is just how history was changed. Everybody thinks McCoy saved Edith from getting run over by that truck, and that wasn't the case. The creepy little guy at the rescue mission (his name in Ellison's script is Rodent) eventually rapes and murders Edith. He doesn't do so in the changed history because he fiddled with McCoy's phaser and disintegrated himself. The significance of this was purposefully obscured, but that's why the phaser scene is in there. What's also not explained is why Kirk and Spock simply didn't take Edith with them into the future, which would have effectively "killed" her in 1930. Neither story ever explains
Edith's death was necessary.
Also, Clark Gable didn't make a movie until 1931.
Hasn't the Edith Keeler story line been mentioned here as a possible ST 13 re-do storyline??
It's almost always mentioned as something worth a revisit, but I think
that everyone is just waiting for Harlan to die so that the chance of a lawsuit is diminished. I was very surprised not only to see him agree to this comic book treatment, but for IDW to risk the wrath of Ellison's lawyers if the little twit ended up unhappy with things. But then again,
I suspect that IDW's own lawyers aren't too shabby, either.
Okay, seriously, when have you ever seen HE sue because he didn't like
the outcome, as opposed to, they just stole the idea?
If he doesn't
like the changes, he just gives them the Cordwainer Bird. The people he sues are, for instance, Jim Cameron, who not only stole two of his
stories (and a couple from others as well) but went around BRAGGING
about it.* He sued and won against Paramount for FUTURE COP, Paramount turning over an inter office menu saying "let's screw over this little
Jew and steal his idea" and used the settlement to buy a billboard
across the street encouraging writers not to roll over and take it in
the backside. He's had a bunch of suits against people that illegally posted his work online. He withdrew his suit against IN TIME when they changed it enough. He sued Paramount for not paying him royalties on
CITY for 40 years. He sued the lazy and worthless Writer's Guild for
making him sue other people in the first place (heh).
When he doesn't like the outcome? He gave the Cordwainer Bird to:
2 episodes of THE HUNGER (the series)
2 movie compilations of THE STARLOST (rather famously)
All 16 episodes of THE STARLOST
1 episode of THE FLYING NUN
And as near as I can tell, that's it, with no overlap of suing and
giving them the Bird.
*The sole exception I know of HE suing over something other than having
his work stolen being Fantagraphics, who posted lies about him on their website, and he won, 'cause they were lies, and didn't take any money -
all he wanted was their lies taken off their website.
First time I saw TERMINATOR I said outloud that it was ripped off from SOLDIER and THE MAN WHO WAS NEVER BORN. I think DEMON WITH A GLASS HAND
is more of a stretch.
First time I saw TERMINATOR I said outloud that it was ripped off from >SOLDIER and THE MAN WHO WAS NEVER BORN.
In article <anim8rfsk-E5A482.13042116072014@news.easynews.com>,
anim8rFSK <anim8rfsk@cox.net> wrote:
First time I saw TERMINATOR I said outloud that it was ripped off from SOLDIER and THE MAN WHO WAS NEVER BORN. I think DEMON WITH A GLASS HAND is more of a stretch.
Many years ago, I read a collection that contained a '40s short story
about an implacable robot that was pursuing a murderer through the
streets of future Somewhere in order to execute him for his crimes.
The robot didn't need rest and would never stop. I've long been trying
to find the story again, but without success. I think it might have
been written by Henry Slesar, but at this very late date I'm not at all
sure.
Also, did anybody ever produce the memo that Ellison claims said
something to the effect of "Let's screw this little Jew and steal his
idea"?
In article <170720141836136511%nope@noway.com>, A Friend <A Friend> wrote: >With regard to Demon with a Glass Hand, you
could -- theoretically -- reduce the entire present-day human race to
the size of a sugar cube, because atoms are mostly empty space. The
cube, however, would weigh five billion tons.
Assuming the average person weighs 150 pounds, I make that more like
500 million. Have you slipped a decimal place?
The future-human-race cube would be ten times the volume, but of course--- Synchronet 3.15a-Linux NewsLink 1.92-mlp
each edge would only be a bit more than twice as long.
could -- theoretically -- reduce the entire present-day human race to
the size of a sugar cube, because atoms are mostly empty space. The
cube, however, would weigh five billion tons.
In article <n8vtpy.1D5@kithrup.com>, David Goldfarb ><goldfarb@ocf.berkeley.edu> wrote:
In article <170720141836136511%nope@noway.com>, A Friend <A Friend> wrote: >> >With regard to Demon with a Glass Hand, you
could -- theoretically -- reduce the entire present-day human race to
the size of a sugar cube, because atoms are mostly empty space. The
cube, however, would weigh five billion tons.
Assuming the average person weighs 150 pounds, I make that more like
500 million. Have you slipped a decimal place?
Oops. Thanks. That's still pretty freaking heavy, though.
We're back up to 5 billion tons for the 70 billion humans.
In article <170720142157162917%nope@noway.com>, A Friend <A Friend> wrote: >In article <n8vtpy.1D5@kithrup.com>, David Goldfarb ><goldfarb@ocf.berkeley.edu> wrote:wrote:
In article <170720141836136511%nope@noway.com>, A Friend <A Friend>
With regard to Demon with a Glass Hand, you
could -- theoretically -- reduce the entire present-day human race to
the size of a sugar cube, because atoms are mostly empty space. The
cube, however, would weigh five billion tons.
Assuming the average person weighs 150 pounds, I make that more like
500 million. Have you slipped a decimal place?
Oops. Thanks. That's still pretty freaking heavy, though.
We're back up to 5 billion tons for the 70 billion humans.
True enough. Still, if we're going to imagine super-duper future
magictech that compactifies all humanity -- reversibly! -- into such
a small space, it's not that much more of a stretch to imagine even
more super-duper magictech that copes with the immense mass.
(I just checked, it's nowhere near the Swarzschild radius.)
Several possibilities:
The cube really does weigh that much, but antigravity and neutralization
of inertia make it act like something that weighs and masses much less.
The cube doesn't really have the compressed bodies. They're stored in
a pocket dimension somewhere, and the cube is just the machinery for
getting them out.
The cube again isn't the bodies, it's just a storage container for information on how to recreate them from surrounding materials.
Someone smarter than me could probably come up with a bunch more ways
that this could be made to work.
In article <WU7xv.19243$LH2.40@fx17.iad>, Danielhttp://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/07/the-city-that-never-sleeps-or-goes-away-harlan -ellison-and-star-trek-again
<dxmm@albury.nospam.net.au> wrote:
On 15/07/2014 12:30 PM, A Friend wrote:
In article <acg8s993skagu886sbdp5i74f2g34ho6sm@4ax.com>, Jim G. <jimgysin@geemail.com.invalid> wrote:
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star Trek, >> Again
howor http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDWrCUs primary Trek writers Scott and David >> Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work on >> the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run (there >> will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about
intothis venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time rCRnosrC# turned
EllisonrCOsrCRhmmmms.rC#
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
I read the original script about 35 years ago, and I don't remember anything about a Bizarro World Enterprise.
The article asks the question, "And yet, now nearly 50 years later,
with numerous Treks behind us, the question still nags: would
betteroriginal script for rCLThe City on the Edge of Forever,rCY have been
I mentioned it, since the J.J. Abrams ST universe is suitably dark and confused that all the weirdnesses of Harlan Ellison's original vision could be recreated from the script fully.than what ended up on screen?" I don't think so. The story is not
about Beckwith, it's about Kirk and Edith Keeler, and Kirk's duty to history and the future. The story didn't require Beckwith or anybody like Beckwith. Accidentally overdosing McCoy gets things rolling quite nicely.
Ellison's ending -- with Beckwith stuck in a time loop getting annihilated every few seconds inside a nova -- is beyond melodramatic.
In the show as seen, Kirk's final line, "Let's get the hell out of
here," is powerful, especially in a day when saying "hell" on U.S. tv
was a very rare thing indeed.
BTW the really confusing thing about City is just how history was changed. Everybody thinks McCoy saved Edith from getting run over by that truck, and that wasn't the case. The creepy little guy at the rescue mission (his name in Ellison's script is Rodent) eventually
rapes and murders Edith. He doesn't do so in the changed history
because he fiddled with McCoy's phaser and disintegrated himself. The significance of this was purposefully obscured, but that's why the
phaser scene is in there. What's also not explained is why Kirk and Spock simply didn't take Edith with them into the future, which would have effectively "killed" her in 1930. Neither story ever explains why Edith's death was necessary.
Also, Clark Gable didn't make a movie until 1931.
Hasn't the Edith Keeler story line been mentioned here as a possible ST
13 re-do storyline??
Not a chance. Nobody's going to touch it. They don't need the almost certain litigation.Yes, you mean taking what they want from the original and turning it every whichway but loose, like they did with Khan... oh, yes, Harlan Ellison would and should just sue and sue and sue if they did that.
Even the Pocket Books novels and various comicsIf they did use the story, they'd of course need Harlan Ellison's permission, probably would need to hire him, and of course pay him.
don't use or refer to City. (One exception, I think: Peter David used
City in something after asking Ellison for permission, which he gave.)
It's almost always mentioned as something worth a revisit, but I thinkThis covers it all, really:
that everyone is just waiting for Harlan to die so that the chance of a lawsuit is diminished. I was very surprised not only to see him agree to
this comic book treatment
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
On Fri, 18 Jul 2014 06:18:41 -0400, A Friend wrote in <180720140618410107%nope@noway.com>:
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
No way. That would mean one single electron weighed millions of tons,
which is obviously wrong.
A quick wikipedia lookup and use of a scientific calculator gives the correct answer: 6.376568037 x 10^-20 kg. Looks like your error was to
forget a minus sign in the exponent. ^_^
(comics group dropped from followup-to -- has there ever been a comic
based on Demon with a Glass Hand?)
In article <MPG.2e35cdca6de8203f989703@news.eternal-september.org>,
angie <angie.3@gmail.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jul 2014 06:18:41 -0400, A Friend wrote in <180720140618410107%nope@noway.com>:
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
No way. That would mean one single electron weighed millions of tons, which is obviously wrong.
A quick wikipedia lookup and use of a scientific calculator gives the correct answer: 6.376568037 x 10^-20 kg. Looks like your error was to forget a minus sign in the exponent. ^_^
Yes, I accidentally dropped the minus sign. Surely that was worth two paragraphs.
(comics group dropped from followup-to -- has there ever been a comic based on Demon with a Glass Hand?)
Yes, there has. Published by DC in 1986 as part of its Science Fiction Graphics Novels series.
http://www.amazon.com/Demon-glass-Science-fiction-graphic/dp/0930289099
Followups restored. Next time you troll, please try to do so
appropriately.
On Sun, 20 Jul 2014 16:00:08 -0400, A Friend wrote in <200720141600080690%nope@noway.com>:
In article <MPG.2e35cdca6de8203f989703@news.eternal-september.org>,
angie <angie.3@gmail.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jul 2014 06:18:41 -0400, A Friend wrote in <180720140618410107%nope@noway.com>:
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
No way. That would mean one single electron weighed millions of tons, which is obviously wrong.
A quick wikipedia lookup and use of a scientific calculator gives the correct answer: 6.376568037 x 10^-20 kg. Looks like your error was to forget a minus sign in the exponent. ^_^
Yes, I accidentally dropped the minus sign. Surely that was worth two paragraphs.
(comics group dropped from followup-to -- has there ever been a comic based on Demon with a Glass Hand?)
Yes, there has. Published by DC in 1986 as part of its Science Fiction Graphics Novels series.
http://www.amazon.com/Demon-glass-Science-fiction-graphic/dp/0930289099
Followups restored. Next time you troll, please try to do so appropriately.
I wasn't trolling.
Followups set to remove Star Trek group, as that's now clearly the least relevant group.
In article <MPG.2e360678231ce70898970a@news.eternal-september.org>,
angie <angie.3@gmail.invalid> wrote:
On Sun, 20 Jul 2014 16:00:08 -0400, A Friend wrote in <200720141600080690%nope@noway.com>:
In article <MPG.2e35cdca6de8203f989703@news.eternal-september.org>,
angie <angie.3@gmail.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jul 2014 06:18:41 -0400, A Friend wrote in <180720140618410107%nope@noway.com>:
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
No way. That would mean one single electron weighed millions of tons, which is obviously wrong.
A quick wikipedia lookup and use of a scientific calculator gives the correct answer: 6.376568037 x 10^-20 kg. Looks like your error was to forget a minus sign in the exponent. ^_^
Yes, I accidentally dropped the minus sign. Surely that was worth two paragraphs.
(comics group dropped from followup-to -- has there ever been a comic based on Demon with a Glass Hand?)
Yes, there has. Published by DC in 1986 as part of its Science Fiction Graphics Novels series.
http://www.amazon.com/Demon-glass-Science-fiction-graphic/dp/0930289099
Followups restored. Next time you troll, please try to do so appropriately.
I wasn't trolling.
Yes, you were. For example, you asked "was there ever a comic about
Demon?" without checking before you deleted the followup.
In article <MPG.2e35cdca6de8203f989703@news.eternal-september.org>,
angie <angie.3@gmail.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jul 2014 06:18:41 -0400, A Friend wrote in
<180720140618410107%nope@noway.com>:
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
No way. That would mean one single electron weighed millions of tons,
which is obviously wrong.
A quick wikipedia lookup and use of a scientific calculator gives the
correct answer: 6.376568037 x 10^-20 kg. Looks like your error was to
forget a minus sign in the exponent. ^_^
Yes, I accidentally dropped the minus sign. Surely that was worth two paragraphs.
(comics group dropped from followup-to -- has there ever been a comic
based on Demon with a Glass Hand?)
Yes, there has. Published by DC in 1986 as part of its ScienceFiction
Graphics Novels series.graphic/dp/0930289099
http://www.amazon.com/Demon-glass-Science-fiction-
Followups restored. Next time you troll, please try to do so
appropriately.
A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
angie <angie.3@gmail.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jul 2014 06:18:41 -0400, A Friend wrote:
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
No way. That would mean one single electron weighed millions of tons, >>>which is obviously wrong.
A quick wikipedia lookup and use of a scientific calculator gives the >>>correct answer: 6.376568037 x 10^-20 kg. Looks like your error was to >>>forget a minus sign in the exponent. ^_^
Yes, I accidentally dropped the minus sign. Surely that was worth two >>paragraphs.
Yes, learn to proofread.
(comics group dropped from followup-to -- has there ever been a comic >>>based on Demon with a Glass Hand?)
Yes, there has. Published by DC in 1986 as part of its Science Fiction >>Graphics Novels series.
http://www.amazon.com/Demon-glass-Science-fiction-graphic/dp/0930289099
Followups restored. Next time you troll, please try to do so >>appropriately.
Asking a question is not trolling.
Wiseguy <epwise@yahoo.com> wrote:graphic/dp/093028909
A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
angie <angie.3@gmail.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jul 2014 06:18:41 -0400, A Friend wrote:
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
No way. That would mean one single electron weighed millions of
tons, which is obviously wrong.
A quick wikipedia lookup and use of a scientific calculator gives
the correct answer: 6.376568037 x 10^-20 kg. Looks like your error
was to forget a minus sign in the exponent. ^_^
Yes, I accidentally dropped the minus sign. Surely that was worth
two paragraphs.
Yes, learn to proofread.
(comics group dropped from followup-to -- has there ever been a
comic based on Demon with a Glass Hand?)
Yes, there has. Published by DC in 1986 as part of its Science
Fiction Graphics Novels series.
http://www.amazon.com/Demon-glass-Science-fiction-
9
Followups restored. Next time you troll, please try to do so >>>appropriately.
Asking a question is not trolling.
How about screwing around with followups as you did? How about
pretending that a troll pretending to be a female sockpuppet isn't a
troll as you did?
How about making your own calculation to show us how smart you are
instead of taking potshots at someone else as you did?
A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote in news:200720141600080690%
nope@noway.com:
In article <MPG.2e35cdca6de8203f989703@news.eternal-september.org>,
angie <angie.3@gmail.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jul 2014 06:18:41 -0400, A Friend wrote in
<180720140618410107%nope@noway.com>:
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
No way. That would mean one single electron weighed millions of tons,
which is obviously wrong.
A quick wikipedia lookup and use of a scientific calculator gives the
correct answer: 6.376568037 x 10^-20 kg. Looks like your error was to
forget a minus sign in the exponent. ^_^
Yes, I accidentally dropped the minus sign. Surely that was worth two paragraphs.
Yes, learn to proofread.
(comics group dropped from followup-to -- has there ever been a comic
based on Demon with a Glass Hand?)
Yes, there has. Published by DC in 1986 as part of its ScienceFiction
Graphics Novels series.
http://www.amazon.com/Demon-glass-Science-fiction-graphic/dp/0930289099
Followups restored. Next time you troll, please try to do so appropriately.
Asking a question is not trolling.
(followups set to remove Trek group)
"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote in news:lqj2s0$9b1$2@news.albasani.net:
Wiseguy <epwise@yahoo.com> wrote:
Asking a question is not trolling.
How about screwing around with followups as you did? How about
pretending that a troll pretending to be a female sockpuppet isn't a
troll as you did?
How about making your own calculation to show us how smart you are
instead of taking potshots at someone else as you did?
I did none of those things. I was just stating a fact and commenting on
the childish rants of "A Friend," who apparently has none of his own.
If you're too stupid to understand that that's your problem.
A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote in
news:210720141624300824%nope@noway.com:
In article <XnsA3714E9CF9DABepwiseyahoocom@69.16.179.22>, Wiseguy <epwise@yahoo.com> wrote:
Asking a question is not trolling.
Deleting followups for no reason is, though. So is deleting followups without notice, as you tried to do here. Inserting your sorry self
into a spent discussion just because you're a blockhead with an
asshole where his judgment should be may or may not be trolling. It
may simply be a cry for help.
Again, I did no such thing.
You are delusional. The last time I checked, you are not the owner
of the Internet. I can say anything I want to whomever I want and if
you don't like it, YOU can go away and make us all happy.
In article <XnsA3714E9CF9DABepwiseyahoocom@69.16.179.22>, Wiseguy <epwise@yahoo.com> wrote:
A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote in news:200720141600080690%
nope@noway.com:
In article <MPG.2e35cdca6de8203f989703@news.eternal-september.org>,
angie <angie.3@gmail.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jul 2014 06:18:41 -0400, A Friend wrote in
<180720140618410107%nope@noway.com>:
The mass of 70 billion electrons equals 6.38 x 10^20 kg.
No way. That would mean one single electron weighed millions of
tons, which is obviously wrong.
A quick wikipedia lookup and use of a scientific calculator gives
the correct answer: 6.376568037 x 10^-20 kg. Looks like your error
was to forget a minus sign in the exponent. ^_^
Yes, I accidentally dropped the minus sign. Surely that was worth
two paragraphs.
Yes, learn to proofread.
How profound.
Fiction(comics group dropped from followup-to -- has there ever been a
comic based on Demon with a Glass Hand?)
Yes, there has. Published by DC in 1986 as part of its Science
Graphics Novels series.graphic/dp/0930289099
http://www.amazon.com/Demon-glass-Science-fiction-
Followups restored. Next time you troll, please try to do so
appropriately.
Asking a question is not trolling.
Deleting followups for no reason is, though. So is deleting followups without notice, as you tried to do here. Inserting your sorry self
into a spent discussion just because you're a blockhead with an
asshole where his judgment should be may or may not be trolling. It
may simply be a cry for help.
On Monday, July 21, 2014 6:07:00 PM UTC-4, angie wrote:
(followups set to remove Trek group)
Well I won't be seeing any other posts...alt.fan.harlan-ellison?
What other group is this more appropriate for besides Star Trek, and maybe
On Tuesday, July 15, 2014 2:01:20 PM UTC-4, Jim G. wrote:
It's almost always mentioned as something worth a revisit, but I think
that everyone is just waiting for Harlan to die so that the chance of a
lawsuit is diminished. I was very surprised not only to see him agree to
this comic book treatment
This covers it all, really:
Harlan Ellison gave his permission for the adaptation.
A classic revisited, just as Harlan envisioned it...
The City that Never Sleeps or Goes Away: Harlan Ellison and Star Trek,
Again
or http://preview.tinyurl.com/l4sppdm
QUOTE
Adapted for the comics by IDW's primary Trek writers Scott and David
Tipton, and with beautiful art by J.K. Woodward (who did slick work on
the Doctor Who/TNG crossover a few years ago) everything about this
release is totally legit. In the debut issue of this limited run (there
will be five in all) IDW Trek editor Chris Ryall writes fondly about how
this venture was his idea, and one that took some convincing of
everybody to go along with. In his words, over time "nos" turned into "hmmmms."
END QUOTE
Okay, so how long until Ellison sues IDW over something about this?
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